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Punishment vs. Forgiveness
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| Former-Teacher | Date: Monday, 07.11.2011, 12:16 | Message # 1 |
 Dean
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| How do you understand these two notions?
How often do people use these strategies in interpersonal relations?
Are these concepts issues of morality only?
Is it possible and necessary to balance these strategies?
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| Teacher | Date: Wednesday, 09.11.2011, 01:42 | Message # 2 |
 Head teacher
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| If a person behaves badly or commits a faux pas, he or she gets punishment or forgiveness sooner or later. The question is what's better, to punish or to forgive? The Orthodox Church teaches us to forgive people. Only a merciful person is able to forgive. It's said that mercifulness is given us by God, and justice (or fairness) is given by Devil, because any kind of justice leads to punishment. Many people say that it's better to forgive than to punish. Why so? I think this point has a right to exist, because usually we want to punish somebody for some bad action or smth. else, but punishment itself is evil to some extent. Punishing somebody we act in a negative way.Forgiving somebody we keep in safe the balance between Good and Evil.
In Vino Veritas...
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| Asya | Date: Wednesday, 09.11.2011, 17:14 | Message # 3 |
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| I agree with you but having just commented some threads dedicated to family issues I can't but say a few words about forgiveness/punishment in a family. I think that we can build another binary opposition: punishment/impunity. It's difficult to determine when forgiveness becomes impunity, the latter being absolutely unacceptable as far as its consequences are absolutely unpredictable. Or, better to say, they are predictable but the scale of the damage is not.
As for me, I suppose that there is no bringing up a child without punishment. Of course, I don't mean corporal punishment though I consider it to be useful sometimes. Words can fail to produce the necessary effect at times. And here punishment is unavoidable. Without any doubt it shouldn't be overused. But parents shouldn't let their children get by with every wrong doing because such boys and girls usually become selfish and light-minded.
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| Zuzu | Date: Wednesday, 09.11.2011, 17:43 | Message # 4 |
 Monitor
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| Crime and punishment. Did you read it? Very instructive. This novel tells us how we mustn't behave and lead our life. One must be in law, always remain a law-abiding citizen. Otherwise he/she will be punished under the law. As for parents , they should both engourage and criticize, forgive and punish bringing the children well, showing what good is and what bad is. I think people who steal,attack or even kill must be severely punished or be sent to the gallows . But what should a prisoner do if he/she isn't guilty? Sometimes it happents that one can be crossed up and betrayed. How can he manage under such circumstances?
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| Luck | Date: Wednesday, 09.11.2011, 21:49 | Message # 5 |
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Union organizer
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| In my opinion these two factors should be balanced in a very good way. Though I myself prefer forgiveness as the main strategy in life. I think that only if we learn to forgive, we will be able to live in harmony with ourselves. If you punish someone then it won’t bring you any pleasure, you will just think “yes, he deserved it, and now I did that”. But is there any sense? At the same time, I can add that there ARE situations when you strongly believe that punishment will make you feel better. Though I still tend to believe that you should think firstly and try to justify this or that deed and forgive.
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| Tanya | Date: Wednesday, 09.11.2011, 22:48 | Message # 6 |
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| I want to say a few words about the notion “punishment”. According to the dictionary punishment is the "authoritative imposition of something negative or unpleasant on a person or animal in response to behavior deemed wrong by an individual or group". But we can say that punishment is used not only in law (for example somebody stole something and that's why he or she must be punished) but also in everyday life, it plays a vital role in keeping order and first of all it concerns children when they are naughty. Sometimes it can be a useful tool.
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| MissJane | Date: Wednesday, 09.11.2011, 23:08 | Message # 7 |
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| Punishment and forgiveness are not, in my understanding, opposite notions. One of the objectives we pursue when we punish someone is that we want to make them realize it is not the way to behave. We may bear no malice against them but still punish them. On the other hand, forgiveness does not presuppose any connivance. ‘To forgive’ means to stop feeling angry or resentful towards someone. Thus we may forgive but punish; and we may employ no penalty but never forgive.
Quote (Zuzu) This novel tells us how we mustn't behave and lead our life. One must be in law, always remain a law-abiding citizen.
Did you really read it? This novel is not about putting oneself within legal boundaries but about self-permission and self-barring and, as a result, repudiation and repentance.
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| Rina | Date: Thursday, 10.11.2011, 00:38 | Message # 8 |
 Union committee president
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| I can't say these two notions are opposed to each other. Being sure they are used in different contexts, I can't treat them as antonyms at all. I'd better provide the following oppositions:
punishment/impunity (Asya has already mentioned that)
vindictiveness/forgiveness
Punishment and impunity define actions that follow one's rule breaking. We can take measures and PUNISH a rule-breaker or we can stay indifferent and inactive and let IMPUNITY flourish.
vindictiveness and forgiveness are more closely connected with one's personal feelings towards the situation. You can FORGIVE and find emotional peace or you can feel offended/worried/humiliated/annoyed/etc. until you take vengeance.
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| Teacher | Date: Thursday, 10.11.2011, 01:02 | Message # 9 |
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| Asya, this is really a great problem: whether to forgive some killer or not. I'm asking myself what would I do, but can't find the answer. On the one hand the only way I see is punishment. But on the other hand... Some people suppose that the only punishment for a murder is to kill the guilty person. Such questions are very debatable. In my opinion there must be a golden mean in everything.
In Vino Veritas...
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| MissJane | Date: Friday, 11.11.2011, 23:06 | Message # 10 |
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| And what would you say about punishment in a family? I guess everyone will agree we can't just let things slide when the child misbehaves. Punishment is qualified to be one of the way to put the offspring in his/her proper place. So many people claim there is no harm in corporal punishment. Of course, they don’t mean severe beating or not letting the child eat or drink for several days. The times of rude torture of children as a way to punish them were gone long ago. Nowadays parents seldom resort to corporal punishment and… regret it. Many researches show mere persuasion and conversation bring no fruit in bringing children up (especially small ones).
By the way, I would rather agree that smacking a child doesn’t hurt him that much as some words can do. However, the most powerful kind of punishment is, to my mind, to ignore the child. When parents don’t speak to their child, show no interest in him, he is more likely to feel rejected and humiliated. I’m sure that sort of punishment should never be used. It can really be damaging to a child’s psyche. That means moral punishment is at times more injuring than any means of corporal punishment.
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| Teacher | Date: Saturday, 12.11.2011, 00:49 | Message # 11 |
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Head teacher
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| Punichment in family must never lead to humiliation of children.
Quote (MissJane) y the way, I would rather agree that smacking a child doesn’t hurt him that much as some words can do.
Physical pain after smacking will disappiar sooner or later, but some rude, cruel words can fix themselves in mind of a child for a long period of time.
In Vino Veritas...
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| lovefootball) | Date: Thursday, 19.01.2012, 21:22 | Message # 12 |
 Dean
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| I agree as far as disregard and demonstrative silence are concerned. I think that ordering a child to stand "in the corner" should be also added to the ban-list! Though it's rather wide-spread my parents have never used it and I'm absolutely sure that even good spanking, a heart-to-heart talk or almost any other punishment and restriction will be more suitable and effective. Oh, one more point to this topic: I can't stand when parents make their children nervous by threatening, I mean something like," If you don't do it, I will leave you in the street..."
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| Nadya | Date: Sunday, 23.09.2012, 14:00 | Message # 13 |
 Union committee president
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| I guess many people have seen shocking reportages about Pussy Riot on TV. In a few words, a group of dressed up girls were singing and dancing on the sanctuary in a church making a video to make a kind of protest. The authorities estimated their activities as an action of hooliganism, so they will serve their two-year sentence in prison. The case can be closed. In fact, all this provoked waves of protests in Europe. Futhermore, the authority of Germany with the leadership of Angela Merkel expressed their dissatisfaction with the sentence and said there's much left to be improved with our democracy. So, European people want Pussy Riot to be free.
As for me, I strongly believe that there must be punishment for such people as if there's not, a lot of other freaks will attempt to repeat such an action or even do something worse. In my view, whether you want to make a protest, you can do that on the streets or wherever but not in the church. We live in a multiethnic country with various religions and every religion has the right to exist and not to be defiled.
And what's your opinion about that?
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| Former-Teacher | Date: Thursday, 27.09.2012, 22:24 | Message # 14 |
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Dean
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| I feel rather outraged at the fact. But the punk group shouldn't have been sentenced to years in prison. Their outrageous act ought to be publicly condemned and disproved but I doubt that the girls have to serve a prison sentence. The announced prison sentence means that society can't cope with these atrocities or doesn't want to. It also means that we all actually don't care. Pussy Riot are reflecting the society's moral decadence. 
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